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Author Topic: What magnification  (Read 413 times)

RetroG

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What magnification
« on: September 20, 2017, 11:59:43 am »
Ok, so I have a new rifle, 6.5 Creedmoor, and I intend to use it for hunting/non-competition target shooting.  I haven't really shopped for scopes in a while for a centerfire rifle that may be shot out past 200 yards.

So far I've kinda settled on a 30mm tube, 40+mm objective, First Focal Plane and MOA reticle. 

What I'm a little undecided upon is the magnification.  3-10x works fine out to 200 yards.  Past that distance what magnification should I be looking at?  Or is that adequate?  I know if the the magnification is too high on the lower end, it can be hard to pick up what you are hunting.  Maybe I don't worry about that and just offset mount a red dot like the 3 gunners do?

coelacanth

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2017, 02:32:20 pm »
So its an AR pattern rifle then?   :hmm
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RetroG

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2017, 04:27:57 pm »
Bolt action.

car-ram-rod

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2017, 08:45:04 pm »
6-24 x50 does everything. thats the perfect scope that'd serve you well for all aspects. In Az theres so dense and so many open areas a 500 yard shot on a coyote or something is normal.

FFP is a good choice. thats all id own to
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Bishop112

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2017, 12:14:56 am »
I personally love my 3-15x scope seems to do everything I need very well but ultimately I will eventually own a 6-24x scope when I can afford it.

JarheadAZ

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2017, 10:08:53 am »
I've done a lot of LR precision competition shooting at 600 and 1000yd over the past two decades, and have participated in many discussions at Snipers' Hide concerning this very subject.

Magnification can be very good for refining the POA and achieving best accuracy, but has its limitations.  As you point out, target acquisition under field conditions can become overly complicated at higher magnifications. Higher magnification can also magnify mirage at extended distances, and I often find myself turning down the mags at distances of 600yd and greater. So, actually, the highest magnifications become more useful closer in, where atmospherics are less pronounced.

For hunting, the typical 3-9x40 has been my standby, and I've never really needed to go with much larger objectives, but I also don't hunt under lower light conditions, where bigger objectives find their best use. My preferred round is the .30-'06, handloaded with the Sierra 165gr Gameking, and cloned with the 168SMK, same mild charge, for my Garand, For my purposes, hunting deer out to around 200yd, maybe some more, this load shoots flat enough for even the quicker shots. I've never lost a deer using it. My  hunter uses a Tasco 2.5-10x42 Mil-Dot.

MY LR chambering is .260, and my MR chambering is .223.

My .260 ran in 1000yd F Open Class for over a decade with a humble Tasco 6-24x42 Mil-Dot scope, usually turned down to about 18X when afternoon mirage picked up significantly. The 24x served most admirably at 200-300yd club match distances, but very soon I economized and went with the .223 for those club matches. It just served the purpose ever so much better.

Eventually, I upgraded the .223 with the Mueller 8-32x44 Target Dot scope. This is a second tier economy scope with very good manners, a 30mm tube, side focus and a price tag in the $250-$275 range. It's performance far outstrips the expectations that its more economical pricetag suggests. I have since upgraded my .260 with the same scope, and mounted a third on my new Savage .308. I have yet to be disappointed with either of the Tascos (I own 3 of them) or the Muellers in going on 20 years (6 years for the Muellers) of competitive F Class shooting experience. I no longer carry a spotting scope, as the Muellers can clearly resolve .22 caliber bullet holes at 300yd. Not bad for Chinese optics.

My Stag Model 6 Super Varminters have Weaver V-24 Classics, and my 16" Bull Barrel AR use the Bushnell 3-12x40 AR Drop Zone BDC scope, with another identical Bushnell on my Mossberg .223 MVP Predator. If I take a moment before getting down to the shooting to range the target vicinity with a Laser Range Finder, the BDC reticle delivers very good accuracy for me. I am Mil-Dot Illiterate when it comes to ranging, since easily 95% of my shooting is done at known distances.

Using the Bushnell, an LRF, and Fed Fusion MSR 62gr ammunition, I have confirmed excellent POI's out 300yd, and can probably be on paper at Laser Ranged distances beyond that out to 500yd, maybe even 600yd.

Greg
« Last Edit: September 21, 2017, 10:29:21 am by JarheadAZ »
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cr

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2017, 03:13:13 am »
I think 6-24x50+ more is a great scope for your rifle with that cal. Don't worry about mirage at the higher powers, all you have to do is turn down the power. You still have the option to go up if need to. If you can buy a higher end brand.

RetroG

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2017, 03:33:15 pm »
I've pretty much came down to a Bushnell veracity 5-25x50mm or a Nikon Monarch 3 4-16x50mm.  Pros and cons to both - Nikon is lighter, simpler reticle, ballistic app for phone, less expensive.  Bushnell has higher magnification, more flexible reticle design.  That's about it.  I'd like to look through both, but I need to find someplace that has both.

428CJ

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2017, 08:41:59 pm »
Have you check out Burris 5x25x50 II scope? Good bang for the buck.
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car-ram-rod

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2017, 09:04:59 pm »
idk if id recommend the burris much right now. theres problems with the focus or parallax in em right now. my buddies needs to go back. there CS isn't bad but its not great either.

with the 2 you mentioned id go bushnell. I don't see Nikon as quality personally.
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428CJ

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2017, 09:11:17 pm »
idk if id recommend the burris much right now. theres problems with the focus or parallax in em right now. my buddies needs to go back. there CS isn't bad but its not great either.

with the 2 you mentioned id go bushnell. I don't see Nikon as quality personally.
What is the trouble with them. One guy I know just got the 4x20x50 and it's doing very well.
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car-ram-rod

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2017, 09:17:41 pm »
not being able to get the reticle and target in focus at the same time.
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RetroG

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2017, 01:53:45 am »
Ack, I made a mental typo, I was looking at a Burris Veracity and a Nikon Monarch.  I own Nikons and I've never had issues with them.  I've never owned a Burris, aside from a Fastfire II, which I won't hold against them, as they replaced it twice.

Bishop112

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2017, 08:30:02 am »
Look at vortex viper hst 6-24. I'm pretty sure they make one in ffp for around that price range.

RetroG

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #14 on: October 04, 2017, 11:55:39 am »
Well, I decided on what scope(s) would be good for this application.  And I prefer to buy locally and actually look through the scope before I buy.  Unfortunately, every gunshop I've gone into to look for any one of the scopes doesn't carry anything but the low end scopes, because "We can't make any money on scopes".  Yeah, especially if you don't stock or sell any.  Especially frustrating when a lot of rifles don't even come with iron sights anymore.  Grr.

coelacanth

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #15 on: October 06, 2017, 11:27:23 am »
There's a guy who does some in depth reviews of mid range scopes that I've learned to trust over the years.  Maybe he has something archived that will help you make a decision.    www.randywakeman.com    Just click on the "Scopes and optics" section near the top of the screen.
"A dying culture invariably exhibits personal rudeness. Bad manners. A lack of consideration for others in minor matters. A loss of politeness, of gentle manners, is more significant than is a riot." 
                                       
     Robert A. Heinlein ,  Friday

RetroG

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Re: What magnification
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2017, 01:10:17 am »
I've narrowed it down to two (maybe three if a private seller isn't flakey), the problem, as I stated above, is no one I've found into the Phoenix metro area carries any in stock.  Even the Vortex scopes in stock are only the second focal plane models.