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Author Topic: Okay I saw the Mohave County property. On the fence about getting it.  (Read 471 times)

PogoJack

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So I came back from kingman-ish and saw a property that a friend of a friend wants to sell.  He inherited it and lives too far to do much with it.  He drove me out to the property, now I have some thinking to do.  Would love some general thoughts from you sages if you don't mind. The land isn't expensive but it isn't cheap, in the aquarius mountains south of I-40.

Pros: It's around 100 acres. Out of the way, but less than a half hour from I-40 on Jeep.  I'm getting a good price for it and he'll even do a land contract with me if I don't want to pay cash.  Property taxes are low and the country side is to my liking with some cattle ranchers nearby.  I can shoot on the property as well from what I'm told. Might need some shtf property away from cities these days. Want to use it as a campground for now. It's flanked by state land and mule deer and elk have been seen in the sector. I saw a lot of jackrabbits and a Mohave Green snake.

Cons: It's 3.5 hour drive from my house,  roads are not traversible without a jeep/atv unless I want to spend $$ improving it.  Would want to get a bulldozer in there to grade the land a bit and build a hogan or other structure eventually,  and probably 60% of it is on a slope. I'd also need to dig a well but maybe I could make a deal with the ranchers. I saw a big hog running a couple of miles from the entrance but don't know if they are out of control.


The idea would be to build something off grid there and hire someone to look out for it to keep squatters or whatnot away. Maybe one of the neighbors,  and then eventually have some livestock and then spend time there in the winter.

Is this a common foolish thing that new AZ residents do, and should I steer clear from it?  I don't mind buying it and keeping it for camping,  but besides taxes and assessments,  I don't want to open myself to additional expenses if that's the case.

Your advice is sought and highly valued.  Thank you in advance.

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    Wyatt Earp

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    I live in Apache County in a similar setup.  One problem with not being at your property all of the time is people will figure that out and help themselves to things they feel they need and you don't.  Took a ton of burglary reports from people that had property that was for when SHTF.  If you can get someone to look after, maybe even live there in a smaller part, that would work better. 

    Don't know about Mohave County, but drilling wells in Apache County is problematic.  Some places are fairly inexpensive as the aquafier is close to the surface, others are not.  I would check with a well driller in the area and find out for sure before committing.

    Allowing ranchers to graze on your land is another issue.  You may think it's a temporary thing and they may think it's permanent.  Make sure you have a contract drawn up by a lawyer you trust before doing that.
    Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.

    Wyatt Earp

    RJ

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    hard to say, but they aren't making land anymore, so buy what you can when you can, might not turn into much for you except that getta away spot, but for some in the future, it may be paradise
    Rj

    5632

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    That would be a great bream.  But to each his own.  So much land would be hard to manage when used just for camping.

    Earl Cordova

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    You saw a Hog ? Probably was a Javelina.

    In my experience, relying on neighbors to help protect your property can be tough.
    We have had a property in the sticks for 10 years and about half of our neighbors will screw you if given the chance.
    Plus the locals can be jealous of the "rich" city people that own multiple properties.

    Digging a well for water is expensive and you are not even guaranteed to find any water.

    Never heard of a Gringo building a Hogan, they either drag in a trailer of some kind or buy one of the big sheds that look like a real small house.

    Sounds like a money pit and will be tough to sell if you get tired of it.








    RJ

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    That would be a great bream.  But to each his own.  So much land would be hard to manage when used just for camping.


    Land isn';t hard to manage , people are

    Starguco

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    Near Kingman.  Kingman is growing in population a lot. I have a friend and his family lives in the area and golden valley.

    Look at the population growth.  It may be a land opportunity for future development.  Just gotta watch out for the alleged meth labs in the area. Pro gun area.
    There is no such thing as Overkill. Die Lehrer Klaus Horstkamp.

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    coelacanth

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    All good advice so far.  Lots of folks have a similar line of thinking - live/work in Phoenix/Tucson - pick up some acreage for hanging out off the grid. 

    Most end up seeing it about as often as they did that time-share they got hosed on 20 years ago.  If you bring a dozer in there, grade a road and start moving dirt around you might as well put up a sign inviting people to the property.  I guarantee that other people will be using that "road" a lot more than you.  Same goes for the well - assuming you drill one or the storage tank if you don't.  Bottom line is, unless you live on the property - or somebody you trust implicitly does - you're going to spend a lot of money that will end up being for the benefit of other people.   Not saying it isn't feasible or even maybe a good idea but you need to go into the situation with your eyes open and a minimum of pre-conceived notions.   

    You've seen this place and none of us have so your opinion is the one that counts here.  Some of the things we discussed in the other thread still apply so due diligence is still called for IMO.  I assume that cash reserves are sufficient to cover things in an emergency without having to sell this property.  From your description it doesn't sound like something that could be liquidated overnight if you find yourself in a tight spot. 
    " A republic, if you can keep it. "
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    FreeInAZ

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    OK here's my 2cents - once owned 2 properties in MI. on the same road, in the same town about 3/4 of a mile apart.
    one was on 1 acre (primary) & the other on 6  acres so 7 acres total. During the warm months it was constant maintenance & spending every Saturday mowing grass, trimming trees, weed whacking, raking leaves etc..etc.. & the polar vortex winters... yeah try blowing snow in -20F every couple of days... when I sold the larger property the poor guy had a near stroke when he got his 1st tax bill as we had owned it since the early 70's and the taxes were capped under headly until ownership changed.. so think about what the REAL AFTER SALE TAXES will be once the county/city gets wind your are the "new sucker/owner"? Even only being 3/4 a mile down the road I had people parking in the driveway (neighbors who figured it would be ok without asking...it wasn't, had people helping themselves to the garden, the apple trees, the pear trees, grape vines, raspberry's etc..etc.. all without asking to the point I started OCing a shotgun on my walks to the larger property so people would be a bit more formal about entering property without asking, which I was always happy to share with neighbors who asked 1st and weren't ass-hats.  Now I'm not saying the place you are looking at will be the same way, but...grass / brush does grow at that elevation I'm told & it does snow/rain so factor that in. Hell, even eskimos in Alaska have issues with trespassers & theft, so I'm betting the I-40 corridor is no exception..  Just my experiences, maybe yours will be better? ;-)
    « Last Edit: June 29, 2020, 12:38:58 am by FreeInAZ »
    Better to die on our feet than live on our knees! "The art of war teaches us to rely not on the likelihood of the enemy's not coming, but on our own readiness to receive him; not on the chance of his not attacking, but rather on the fact that we have made our position unassailable." -Sun Tzu

    RJ

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    Well now, lots to think about for sure, horror stories are generally just that.
    I own a whole lotta land all over Arizona, from the sec of Arizona on border to kingman area to almost four corners (not rez of course), and all over central Az. and what some say is clear, some folks are under the impression if no one is around well, fair game. A lot depends on what you build, and or improve.
    MOst will abide by the sign, but there is always some knucklehead willing to push the limit.

    it would be prudent to scope the area out and just see if or who neighbors wanna be. I still have quite a few acquaintances i met up south of I40 by Ashfork, lots boys and gals living off the grid, as well as a joint over on NM border lotsa folks off the grid. I took the time to locate land owners and one had to be sure they were the owners, as there were a few squatters, it is remote, meaning not a whole lotta traffic, hunters, and rockhounds ect.
    FOlks off of I40 generally wont' go more than a few miles looking for something, just something i've heard from locals who are in fact off the corriedor

    Lots of options, these days a solar collector with a satelite connection and camera can provide a whole lotta info.
    I have land in Rio Rico, that i've never seen, lol, just happen to buy at an auction after developer (actually a road builder, not  developer in any sense of the word) went under.
    In any event, as i mentioned earlier, the taxes are cheap, and land does not depreciate typically, unless of course it was inflated to begin with.
    Just ensure its titled by tile company, taxe information is current, and what mineral rites do you retain, along with water.

    And lastly if you choose to not participate in the opportunity, give a shout, I may be interested, as hell nothing like being a land baron.  :rotfl

    GTGallop

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    Here's my question....
    How often do you intend on using it?  Not as a SHTF Property.  Before the SHTF.

    Will you be going up once a month?  Every other week?  Every other month?

    Now take that price he quoted you and look for something closer, maybe half as much land but half as close.  Can you get 40 acres that are 90 minutes away?  If so does that change how often you would enjoy the land?

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/0000-Pack-Mule-Rd-Wikieup-AZ-85360/2103061528_zpid/

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/Xxx-Auga-Caliente-Road-Hyder-AZ-85333/2086091907_zpid/

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/Acr-N5500-LOT-108-Concho-AZ-85924/2084551238_zpid/

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/Sec-19-T15n-R16e-Nw4-Nw4-sw4-Nw4-Cr-LOT-001B-Heber-AZ-85928/2093533690_zpid/
    The only thing that separates man from animal is our affinity for toilet paper.
    Once we, as a society, lose that affinity, we begin to descend back into the animal kingdom, and after three or more days you will find the food chain beginning to invert on itself.

    https://www.qrz.com/db/n5mkh

    PogoJack

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    Wow, you guys are the absolute best of the best.

    GT, I had no idea. Thank you very much for this info! These places are more to my liking for off grid living. I definitely love the northeast area more than the northwest climate wise and those lands are flat!

    The other property had two huge hills and not that much flat land and I would rather drive 3+ hours to Apache County than to Mohave County. Population wise though, I think Mohave might be more sparse, which is  a plus.

    On the plus for White Mountains, it's the same distance and in the summer is probably more than 10 degrees cooler than Phoenix.
    One of my local employees is from the White Mountains and did a bit of missionary work in Navajo nation, building things and such and can probably hook me up with some reputable builders in the area. Not stuck on a hogan but that's what I know, they work awesome in the Los Padres Natl Forest in  California and I suppose since they originate near Navajo nation, must be pretty good in this area too.

    And that critter I saw bounding across the road was definitely a hog. I know the difference between Javelina and hog, that's why it startled and vexed me.
    « Last Edit: June 29, 2020, 11:52:57 am by PogoJack »

    coelacanth

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    Well now, lots to think about for sure, horror stories are generally just that.
    I own a whole lotta land all over Arizona, from the sec of Arizona on border to kingman area to almost four corners (not rez of course), and all over central Az. and what some say is clear, some folks are under the impression if no one is around well, fair game. A lot depends on what you build, and or improve.
    MOst will abide by the sign, but there is always some knucklehead willing to push the limit.

    it would be prudent to scope the area out and just see if or who neighbors wanna be. I still have quite a few acquaintances i met up south of I40 by Ashfork, lots boys and gals living off the grid, as well as a joint over on NM border lotsa folks off the grid. I took the time to locate land owners and one had to be sure they were the owners, as there were a few squatters, it is remote, meaning not a whole lotta traffic, hunters, and rockhounds ect.
    FOlks off of I40 generally wont' go more than a few miles looking for something, just something i've heard from locals who are in fact off the corriedor

    Lots of options, these days a solar collector with a satelite connection and camera can provide a whole lotta info.
    I have land in Rio Rico, that i've never seen, lol, just happen to buy at an auction after developer (actually a road builder, not  developer in any sense of the word) went under.
    In any event, as i mentioned earlier, the taxes are cheap, and land does not depreciate typically, unless of course it was inflated to begin with.
    Just ensure its titled by tile company, taxe information is current, and what mineral rites do you retain, along with water.

    And lastly if you choose to not participate in the opportunity, give a shout, I may be interested, as hell nothing like being a land baron.  :rotfl
    Sounds a bit like some of my adventures .  .  .   ;-D.   I actually went down to Rio Rico to look at the land before deciding against it many years ago.  Same story about a developer going under - may have been the same general place/time frame.   I also ended up looking at some stuff over by Portal and on down into the Deming, Lordsburg, Silver City, N.M.  area.  As you say, pretty remote and sparsely populated.
    " A republic, if you can keep it. "
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    RJ

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    Sounds a bit like some of my adventures .  .  .   ;-D.   I actually went down to Rio Rico to look at the land before deciding against it many years ago.  Same story about a developer going under - may have been the same general place/time frame.   I also ended up looking at some stuff over by Portal and on down into the Deming, Lordsburg, Silver City, N.M.  area.  As you say, pretty remote and sparsely populated.

    Portal land of the lost, our family ranch was due west of there along the border, spend a few life times overnite in portal, lol, still have acreage there, lots of it, not portal but way west go west young man.

    i just happen to pick up land as i could afford it, have managed to off load some that allowed the land fund to grow and buy more. looking at a big piece today or tomorrow north of anthem, hehe, we will see.
    Rj

    coelacanth

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    I liked the area around Portal.  Had the idea of having my own little hunting preserve down there back in the day.  Love the whole area around the Chiricahuas but its a long way to get there from my home base in Phoenix.  Got some relatives down that way around Sonoita and Sierra Vista and used to date a girl from down around Patagonia with a big family down there.  Southeast Arizona is a fine place to get lost in.   :thumbup
    " A republic, if you can keep it. "
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    GTGallop

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    Southeast Arizona is a fine place to get lost in.   :thumbup

    DITTO!

    I love the people and culture of SE-AZ
    I love the land of the Rim Country
    I love the remoteness of the White Mountains
    The only thing that separates man from animal is our affinity for toilet paper.
    Once we, as a society, lose that affinity, we begin to descend back into the animal kingdom, and after three or more days you will find the food chain beginning to invert on itself.

    https://www.qrz.com/db/n5mkh

    GTGallop

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    GT, I had no idea. Thank you very much for this info! These places are more to my liking for off grid living.

    Eh no worries - Dream Surfing Zillow for off grid property is kind of my hobby.  It was super easy.  I'm just not sure where you are and what you are looking for so I picked a smattering around the state.  One of those was on for more than 1000 days if I recall.  Sounds like someone that wants that much and no less or they will cut a deal to be done.

    For me, 3.5 hours is a deal killer.
    I need to be 90 minutes under ideal circumstances and 2.5 hours under rough conditions.
    Plan on putting a Home Depot Style portable Shed on it as a "permanent tent" to store some gear in for convenience and nothing of value.

    Look into Tax Lien Sales too.  February is Tax Lien Season in AZ.  Rules vary by county but in a nutshell it works like this.
    1. Someone doesn't pay taxes for about 3 years.  You "bid" on the property to pay the back tax at X interest rate not to exceed about 18% in most counties.  If you bid 12% and I bid 10% then I win.
    2. The property owner has 3 more years to pay you the back taxes plus the X% that you bid.
    3. You keep paying the taxes and they owe you the back tax plus interest for the remaining 3 years.  Your MAX investment in the property in question is now 6 years of taxes.
    4. If they don't pay ALL of it after 3 years - you get the property.
    5. If that property is LAND then there is no eviction process.  Houses and store fronts take a little more paperwork and maybe a constable (Vote Chris Wible).
    6. You own that property AS IS so make sure you want it and do your research first.  If it has a mine on it that becomes a Superfund Clean Up Site - THAT IS YO SITE.

    I know that sounds scary but Yavapai has some property that comes up for sale at $36 a year for three years.  You get the land for $108 in tax auction and pay another $108 over the remainder of the time.  If they pay it off.  You get your $216 back plus the (assuming) 15% interest.  So a total of about $332.  Or they don't pay and you get the land.

    Believe it or not there is a LOT of land in AZ that is privately owned and the AZ owners have passed leaving their land to city slickers back in Minneapolis, Chicago, Boca Raton, Manhattan, you name it.  Young families with young kids in an excellent school system with great jobs and no reason to move to or ever visit the remotest part of the White Mountains to see Grandpa's old Gold Claim.  And they have no idea what to do with it since it is worthless.

    https://www.yavapai.us/treasurer/treasurers-back-tax-sale
    https://treasurer.maricopa.gov/Pages/LoadPage?page=LiensAndResearch
    https://www.gilacountyaz.gov/government/treasurer/tax_lein_sale.php


    Like I said.  That's not even close to an intro / primer on the topic and it is VERY MUCH CAVEAT EMPTOR so do the research.  But those sites should get you moving in the right direction.

    The only thing that separates man from animal is our affinity for toilet paper.
    Once we, as a society, lose that affinity, we begin to descend back into the animal kingdom, and after three or more days you will find the food chain beginning to invert on itself.

    https://www.qrz.com/db/n5mkh

    AZ Husker

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    Questions I'd want to know: How far away is power? Does the ground perk test for a septic system? What are the building restrictions? And mainly do you have legal permanent easement into your land? Lots of folks bought a few acres here and there only to find out they couldn't even access them.

    coelacanth

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    DITTO!

    I love the people and culture of SE-AZ
    I love the land of the Rim Country
    I love the remoteness of the White Mountains
    I like the whole thing except for a few septic tanks masquerading as towns and cities.  I like all of the "four corners" states and could happily spend a lifetime or two exploring them from one end to the other.  I ended up in Arizona because I had more relatives here than anyplace else so it seemed like a natural.  Been a lot of changes since I first saw it in 1959 but I still like it better than most places - relatives and all.   :whistle
    " A republic, if you can keep it. "
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    Starguco

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    Questions I'd want to know: How far away is power?

    Interesting question to ask for the purchaser. I know that whomever owns it can easily put up a windmill for power and solar as well. The winds in that area are usually so strong & frequent that wind power is a easy option.
    There is no such thing as Overkill. Die Lehrer Klaus Horstkamp.

    "We must reject the idea every time a law's broken, society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker. It is time to restore the American precept that each indiviual is accountable for his actions." Ronald Reagan

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